Governor Bill Weld Mounting Challenge against President Trump: Discusses Health Care, Climate Change and Bipartisanship

Governor Bill Weld

Margaret Flinter: Welcome to Conversations on Health Care with Mark Masselli and
Margaret Flinter , a show where we speak to the top thought leaders
in health innovation , health policy , care delivery and the great minds
who are shaping the health ca re of th e future. This week Mark and
Margaret speak with former Republican Massachusetts ’ Governor Bill
Weld who is running a primary against President Trump in the 2020
election. Governor Weld also served as the assistant U.S. attorney
general under Presi dent Rea gan and says he is mounting the
challenge because he believes the country is in “grave danger”. He ’ ll
talk about his views on health care, climate change, LGBT rights, fiscal
responsibility and the need for more cooperation ac ross party lines .

Lori Robert son also checks in , Managing Editor of factcheck .org , look s
at misstatements spoken about health policy in the public domain ,
separating the fake from the facts . We end with a bright idea that ’ s
improving health and well - being in everyday lives. If you hav e
comments please e - mail us at chcradio@chc 1 .com or find us on
Facebook , Twitter , iTunes, or wherever you listen to p odcast and you
can also hear us by asking Alexa to pl ay the program Conversations on Health Care . Now , stay tuned for our interview with Governor Bill
Weld on Conversations on Health Care .

Mark Masselli: We ’ re speaking today with former Governor Bill Weld of
Massachusetts , long known as a moderate Republican a nd was the
nominee for Vice President on th e 2016 Libertarian ticket with Gary
Johnson. Governor Weld has rejoined the GOP and is challeng ing for
the Republican nomination for the 2020 Presidential race. Governor Weld served as U.S. Attorney for the State of Massachusetts before
being promoted to A ssistant U.S. Attorney General under President
Reagan. He earned his bachelor ’ s degree and his JD from Harvard.
Governor Weld welcome to Conversations on Health Care.

Governor Weld: Mark and Margaret it ’ s a pleasu re being with you.

Mark Masselli: You ’ ve be en described as a maverick, not afraid to challenge the
status quo and you we re the first Republican to win the Governor seat
in the blue state of Massachusetts in decades. You ran for Vice
President as a Libertari an in 2016 citing concerns about the direc tion
the GOP was headed in. Now , you ’ re challenging the party
infrastructure , a challenge against the incumbent President saying
you ’ re doing this because you feel the country is in grav e peril. I
wonder if you could tell our listeners about your decision to mount a
challenge against President Trump and what are the driving forces
behind it.

Governor Weld: Well, the driving force is I ’ d like to do the job. There are a lot of things
I don ’ t think are being done in Washington D . C . For example, nobody
seems to know how to cut spending $1 . The President has vetoed a
single dollar of spending and his latest budget would add another $7.9

Governor Bill Weld

trillion to the accumulated deficit , so it will be up around $ 30 trillion.
That ’ s simply not fair to the younger generations who are going to
have to foot the bill and I think it ’ s hugely irresponsible.

When I was in office , I cut spending year - over - year in absolute dollars
and was ranked the most fiscally conservati ve governor in the United
States. Every governor balances her or his budget every year at the
state level. The truth is we need a balanced budget amendment to
require the federal government to do what all the states do and what
every household does which i s to balance its checkbook at the end of
the month.

Another thin g, I want to spend a lot more attention on is climate
change. The President has a one word policy for climate change and
global warming, which is hoax. Well, it ’ s all very nice and cute to ha ve
a one word policy, but it doesn ’ t bespeak de ep thought or a re search.
In terms of peril , I think the President has played fast and loose with
North Korea in terms of nuclear weapons and that ’ s just not an area
where you want to threaten people and b luste r and change your tune
all the time. You got to make people unde rstand that no, there ’ s a
one way ratchet on nuclear weapons and it ’ s called decommissioning
them and ridding the world of nuclear weapons to the extent
possible.

Climate change is another . P erhaps the most fundamental is the
President ’ s apparent desire t o introduce more elements of autocracy
into our democracy. He mocks openly the rule of law. He mocks the
idea of a free press. I understand little boys want to be the man on
the white horse, b ut that ’ s not the American way. That ’ s also driving
me .

Margaret Flinter: Governor Weld , you bring just tremendous experience garner ed
throughout your career and as a popularly elected Republican in a
largely very blue state and you became known for the art of
compromise something that we ’ re sorely missing and would li ke to
see return to the national stage if you ’ re going to address these big
problems and you called on climate change as one , the budget, but
education , health care, our infrastructure, we all think that that ’ s
going to require the art of compromise and bi partisanship to make a
difference. How do the lessons that you learned in your role as
governor factor into what you think you might be able to accomplish
on the national stage?

Governor Weld: Well, certainly in office , as governor , I made it my business t o reach
across the aisle to get things done for the people that we all represent
both the executive and the legislature. It was very effective . Within
my first month I proposed weekly meet ings between myself and my
great Lieutenant Governor Paul Cellucci o n the one hand and the
Democratic Speaker of the House and President of the Senate. We did

Governor Bill Weld

that once a week, for two terms. It was such a good idea that it was
continued to this day . Charl ie Baker who was a two time cabinet
member for me is now the g overno r and he does the same thing. It ’ s
just a lot harder to stab somebody in the back or tell the press that
somebody is a jerk if you know you ’ re going to be having coffee and
doughnuts with them sometime in the next week . When I worked in
the federal governm ent , including in the legislature , I worked both for
the Senate and for the House . It was before the Bad New Days . People
did listen to each other. If somebody was going to give a speech on
the Senate floor, the galleries would be packed with people who
wa nted to hear the speech . Foreign policy , disagreement stopped at
the water ’ s edge, but it ’ s just kind of fallen out of a possibility in the
last 10 years and we need to get that b ack.

I don ’ t want to rejoin the party of haters and people who are
threateni ng to punish people. I want to rejoin the p arty of Abraham
Lincoln. That ’ s the Republican Party that I ’ d like to see in the future.

Mark Masselli: I ’ d like to pull the thread on y our thoughts about health care and it ’ s
really a topic that animates the conv ersations around kitchen tables
all across America. There ’ s still the crushing weight of cost associated
with health care access. We hear on the Democratic side that a
number, no t all of the candidates running are embracing Medicare for
all. You ’ ve long be en a fan of expanding Medicaid often facing some
challenges within your own party with that proposition. I ’ m
wondering if you could again share your vision for health policy .

Gov ernor Weld: Well, first of all, I think the slogan Medicare for All is not goi ng to get
the job done because it doesn ’ t pay for anything. It would essentially
mean we have a gigantic single payer system and the private health
insurance industry would shriv el up and disappear. All that would
mean is a gigantic tax increase and it wou ldn ’ t do anything to the
structure of health care delivery. I ’ m one of those who says that we
should stop arguing about whether we ’ re going to repeal the
Affordable Care Act . Cle arly , there ’ s not a consensus in Congress.
What we should do is try to improve the present system to the extent
we can. When you ’ re talking about health care there ’ s always two
important imperative s .

One is to make sure that we maintain the quality of heal th care in the
United States, which is by far the best in the entire world an d to make
sure that the costs are survivable . Once you agree on the goals, then
it seems to me there ’ s an opportunity to think of small reforms that
c ould make the situation bet ter. One thing that I really don ’ t
particularly care for with the structure of the Affordable Care Act , it ’ s
that it ’ s awfully government driven and I would like to see
incremental changes made so that more decisions are made between
the doctor and the pat ient and not by the government. In general , my

Governor Bill Weld

guiding political philosophy is the most power, the most decision
making should be in the hands of the individual . One example of that
is I think a woman ’ s right to make decisions about her own body in
terms of terminating a pregnancy.

I ’ d like to see individuals be able to have tax adv antage to health
savings accounts so that they can decide how much they want to save
for health care. It wouldn ’ t be where the government mandates a
catalogue for everybody. T he cost of the Affordable Care Act is driven
in part by the fact that it presuppo ses that everybody wants to pay for
and undergo the cost of an enormous array of programs to make sure
that no matter what happens they ’ re always going to have access to
the m ost expensive procedures available and some people buy with a
high deductible , be cause they know the insurance is going to be
cheaper that way.

Other people say, no, I can ’ t afford to do that. I ’ ve got to have dollar -
one coverage and people can make those decisions for themselves.
People aren ’ t stupid. I think people should be able t o buy insurance,
including health insurance across state lines. I think they should be
able to purchase prescription drugs whose cost is a national scandal
right no w w herever th ey want to find them. If there ’ s cheaper
prescription drugs in Canada, let them purchase the prescription
drugs in Canada because a lot of the elderly in particular are being
priced out of the market by the cost of prescription drugs .

Margaret Flinter: Som ething else I th i nk you ’ ve be e n really clear about in your career is
your advoc acy for groups who often don ’ t get due attention. You ’ ve
long advocated for the rights of the LGBTQ community. I know you ’ ve
been a great advocate for strengthening protectio n for victims of
domestic violence and also for addressing the inequities that imp act
minority communities . Maybe you share with us some of the policies
or positions that you would seek to better support these and other
underserved or discriminated against populations ?

Governor Weld: I consider that the essence of a democracy is the ide a that the
individual shall never be thrust in a corner by government and there ’ s
a reason for that. If anybody has to live in the shadows as it were, that
weakens the bond s that keep us together as a nation . The y weaken
the bonds of society. When I was ru nning for office I met a good
number of gay and lesbian people who told me about their lives living
in the shadows , fearing the police , living in underground , going to
under ground bars where nobody else would come and just this idea
of fear.

So, you ’ re ri ght, I was very open about gay and lesbian civil rights. I
appointed the woman who wrote the opinion holding that gay
marriage was constitutionally required under the equal protection
and due process clauses , and that opinion that went to the Supreme

Governor Bill Weld

Court and was the basis for the change nationally . When I came into
office, I went right to the Hispanic community, the Asian community
and the black community, communities of co lor and said, “ I want to
have a Hispanic - American commission. I want to ha ve an Asi an -
American commission, I want to have African - Caribbean - American
commission . ” I ap pointed very prominent individuals to a commission
of maybe 30 members apiece. I would me et with them once a month
and say, “ What can I do ? ” My chief of staff and my chief r evenue
officer were a gay couple whose marriage I participated in. My
cabinet consiste d of eight women and three men and always included
minorit ies . Everybody had this sen se that everybody was welcome
and I think that ’ s one of the functions of government. I would say the
current incumbents in Washington D . C . and the Oval Office d oesn ’ t
seem to share that view.

I recall the days of President Reagan who I served for seven ye ars. He
wanted to make everybody feel good about being an American and he
largely suc ceeded in that . I ’ ve been a trial lawyer so I saw cases where
a woman would come in to court Monday morning, all black and blue
and say , my boyfriend or my husband beat th e tar out of me over the
weekend. The judge will say, well, lean down and say, what d id you do
to irritate your boyfriend or your husband? It ’ s just unthinkable. I
appointed the first victim witness coordinator so the victims would be
heard and made all the judges take instruction in how to treat these
cases. I recognize the defense of a b attered women ’ s syndrome and
actually commuted the sentences of eight women who had been
convicted of manslaughter for in self - defense , killing their husband or
boyfrie nd who ’ s advancing on them with a knife. That was another
victim class that I thought de served to be called out and get
recognition.

Mark Masselli: We ’ re speaking today with Governor Bill Weld, former two term
governor of the state of Massachusetts and a 2 016 candidate for Vice
President on the Libertarian ticket. Governor Weld ha s mounted in
committee to challenge President Trump for the Republican
nomination in the 2020 Presidential Race . Governor Weld let ’ s talk
about climate change. It ’ s still hard to be lieve that there are people
who are battling the science. You ’ ve recently stated that y ou would
hope most Republicans could at least get behind the idea that we all
should have access to clean air and clean water. That sort of seems
small in the context of the legacy of a party of conservation and you
go back to President Grant who created Y ellowstone National Park.
You ’ ve got President Nixon who created the EPA. I ’ m wondering if you
could talk a little more about the climate change debate.

Governor Weld: Sure . There ’ s one more eminent Republican who should be added to
that list Teddy Rooseve lt who spent a lot of time camping out at
Yosemite. Next thing you know, we had a National Park System, but I

Governor Bill Weld

think that Europe has its monuments and its cathedrals. We have our
mountains and our valleys and our rivers and streams and we damn
well better p rotect them. I often say up in New Hampshire, how do
you like to have the White Mountains with no snow , bec ause that ’ s
what ’ s going to happen if nothing is done about global warming and
climate change. When the polar ice cap goes it ’ s going to have
enormou s consequences, not only to sustain life itself, but also all of
our coastlines are going to be totally rec onstructe d.

There ’ s going to be a lot of short front property that ’ s right now 10 or
15 miles inland and it ’ s not all that far away, but it ’ s possib le to plan
ahead for these things and that ’ s what we have to do. We have to
plan ahead as opposed to saying hoax, hoax, hoax and putting our
blinder over our eyes and say, there ’ s nothing that can be done about
this. One action I would take right away is t o rejoin the Paris climate
accords and we have to adopt targets for 2050 in terms of CO2
emissions that are consistent with what other industrialized nations
have done. It just won ’ t do for a country as big and important as the
United States to say, oh, ev eryone else can go solve this problem.
We ’ re going to stick our head in the sand and ignore it. That ’ s exac tly
what the present administration is doing . To the extent that they
claim lots of credit for deregulation in Washington .

I look at where the empha sis has been. It ’ s been on deregulations in
the environmental area and it seems to be aimed at clean air and
clean water. I can ’ t understand why people don ’ t see that we ’ ve got
to pull together on climate change.

Margaret Flinter: Well, Governor another on this somewhat long list of life and death
issues that we face as a society is certainly education and ac cess to
education. I know that ’ s been a critically important issue to you in
your life and career. I ’ ve read that your own family is eight
generations of Harvard graduates I think if I ’ ve ---

Governor Weld: Couldn ’ t get in anywhere else .

Margaret Flinter: Well , that ’ s great but you know education is so important to all of us.
We ’ re very focused both on training the next generation of health
care professi onals, but also really looking around our communities
and saying what can we do to advance the education of our
community members who need to advance in education training if
they ’ re going to participate fully in our society and yet the cost of
higher educ ation, even within states, even within our public
universities is very challenging for many people. What are yo ur
thoughts about how we make education more available to people, to
the benefit of our whole society?

Governor Weld: Well, lifelong learning is an idea whose time has long since arrived
and it ain ’ t a luxury anymore. It ’ s an absolute necessity. Even 15 ye ars

Governor Bill Weld

ago when I was talking to graduating seniors from high school I would
say, look you a re going to have not only seven different jobs in your
l ife, you a re going to have seven different careers , s o you better take
enough of liberal arts to be supple enough to change from one to the
other because you don ’ t know what that next career is going to be. I
look at the displacement that ’ s just about to o ccur in the next 15
years as a result of advances in technology, artificial intelligence,
drones, robotics, machi ne learning, autonomous , that ’ s to say self -
driving vehicles. They ’ re going to rearrange 15 % to 20% of the jobs
that currently exist in the Uni ted States.

Think of someone who ’ s a long haul trucker. You ’ ve got automated
self - driving vehicles, and that jo b is no longer going to exist. There will
be replacement jobs. They ’ re going to require technical skills and
those skills are roughly equivalent to the first two years of post -
secondary education post high school. That ’ s the community college
level . I t hink we could very easily provide for those workers who are
going to be displaced. In 2016 , they would have been called Trump
voters , right, but I don ’ t see the current administration doing anything
to get out in front of what ’ s going to happen. I think we cou ld very
easily put something together, a partnership between the federal
government and the states so that those displaced workers could go
fre e to a community college or the equivalent and acquire those skill
sets so they could get the replacement jobs.

I think of this as the future of work, but it ’ s really the future of work
and education and I think we should put a lot more emphasis and
encou rage and even have the government encourage online courses
and that could be very valuable. A lot of people can ’ t afford to take
two years off to go do that. I think that ’ s part of the wave of the
future as well. At the college level, we ’ ve now got a feder al law that
says students can ’ t re - negotiate their student debt. It ’ s unthinkable to
me. That ’ s got to be repeale d right away. One more thing we
shouldn ’ t lose sight of K through 12 either. I think possibly the thing
I ’ m proudest of that I did as Governor was I entered into a grand
bargain with the Democrats in the legislature and the Teacher ’ s Union
and we agreed to put more money into K through 12.

In return, I required what are called management givebacks in other
words accountability and standards. We put in high stakes tests for
kids in fourth, eighth and tenth grade. If you don ’ t pass the test, y ou
don ’ t go ont o the next grade. No more you get to 12th grade and
Johnny [PH] still can ’ t read and doesn ’ t know anything about m ath,
but he gets a sheepskin , he ’ s sent off to community college where he
still can ’ t read or do math. The community college has to send him
i nto remedial programs there and that ’ s not good for the community
college. It ’ s not really good for Johnny. But until we pass ed that and
had th ose requirements Massachusetts wa s like 26, 27 out of the 50

Governor Bill Weld

states i n terms of academic performance . S inc e we did that for 25
years in a row Massachusetts has been number one in the country in
both reading and math. That ’ s something that can be done in th e
education area that ’ s just going to benefit everybody.

Mark Masselli: Governor Weld , what are the challe nges you would face if elected
President would be dealing with the divisions that exist in the
country ? S ome analyst s have said that we ’ re the most di vided since
the civil war as a country. I ’ m wondering what steps can people take
that might bring them to listen to each other , and the political side
h ow would you really try to bring about better civil discourse?

Governor Weld: Well, I was President I wo uld try to do what I did as Governor , which
is to reach out to everybody and make sure that we ’ re unleashing the
energies of everyone treating everyone with respect. That ’ s not done
by this administration. They start with immigration. They want to
scare pe ople. Mr. Trump has said many times the most important
thing is to instill fear. Steve Bannon who is his ch ief campaign
architect, has said, “ if Trump is reelected, it will be Trump
unchanged. ” Essentially , he ’ s saying no one will be safe. It ’ s not a
coinc idence that the title of Bob Woodward ’ s book about Mr. Trump
is Fear . Right from the beginning this administra tion has tried to scare
us into thinking that we ’ re all under siege by every other country, but
our own . I see the danger as being quite different . I see it as being
autocracy and the erosion of democracy.

I don ’ t think it ’ s any secret strategy of the Tru mp campaign and of Mr .
Trump ’ s adm inistration is to divide people, stir up the pot and get
everybody ’ s teeth on edge. Even the kind of outreach an d it may
seem trivial, but these commissions of Hispanics and Asians and
African - Americans, Caribbean American s, it may seem like a small
thing, but I don ’ t know. They went back to their communities and
said, hey, this guy ’ s really listening. It really tak es two things.
Cooperation across the political aisle is important, but showing that
you wa nt to have America United, showing that you care about the
word United in the United States of America that ’ s probably the most
important thing of all.

Margaret Flin ter: We ’ ve been speaking today with Governor Bill Weld, former two term
Governor of the State of Massachusett s. He has mounted committee
to challenge president Trump for the Republican nomination in the
upcoming Presidential Race . You can learn more about his work and
his vision for 2020 and beyond by going to weld20 20.org or follow
him on Twitter @GovBillWeld. G overnor Weld thank you so much for
your commitment to public service and for sharing your thoughts on
critical issues facing the country today on C onversations on Health
C are .

Governor Weld: Thank you so much Margaret and Mark.

Governor Bill Weld

Mark Masselli: Thank you so much.

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Mark Masselli: At Conversations on Health Care we want our audience to be truly in
the know when it comes to the facts about health c are reform and
policy. Lori Robertson is an award winning journalist and managing
editor of factcheck .org , a n onpartisan , nonprofit consumer advocate
for voters that aim to reduce the level of deception in U.S. politics.
Lori, what have you got for us this week ?

Lori Robertson: How has the number of people without health insurance changed
under President Donald Tru mp? The latest report from the National
Health Interview Survey shows an increase in the uninsured of about
1.1 million as of the first nine mo nt hs of 2018 compared with 2016.
9.2% of the population lacked coverage during the period up from 9%
in 2016. A m uch greater rise was reported by a Gallup survey cov ering
the final quarter of 2018. Gallup put the rise in uninsured adults at
about 7 million c omp ared with the last half of 2016. Gallup found the
percentage of uninsured adults was 13.7% in the October th rough
December quarter. Besides the differing time periods Gallup covers
only adults age 18 and over while the NHIS cove rs all ages including
chi ldren.

NHIS said the 1.1 million increase it found was not statistically
significant but taken together both s urveys point to an upward trend
that seems to have accelerated during the latter part of 2018.
President Trump failed to repeal and replace the A ffordable Care Act
as he promised to do, but he did reduce advertising and outreach
aimed at enrolling people i n ACA insurance plans. In December 2017 ,
he signed a tax bill that ended the ACA ’ s tax penalty for people who
failed to obtain coverage. In March , the Trump administration joined
an effort by GOP state attorneys general seeking a court decision to
overturn t he ent ire act.

The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office estimated that with the
end of the mandate penalty 3 million people will drop or lo se
coverage this year and another 2 million in 2020 and that ’ s my
fact check for this week. I ’ m Lori Robertson, m anaging editor of
factcheck .org .

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Margaret Flinter: Factcheck .org is committed to factual accuracy from the country ’ s
major political pla yers and is a project of the Annenberg Public Policy
Center at the University of Pennsylvania. If you have a fac t that you ’ d
like checked, e - mail us at www.chcradio.com , we ’ ll have
factcheck .org ’ s Lori Robertson che ck it out for you here on
Conversations on Health Care.

Governor Bill Weld

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Mark Masselli: Each week Conversations highlight s a bright idea about how to make
wellness a part of our communities and everyday lives. When Leanne
Brown was a graduate student in nutritional science at NYU , she came
to understand the enormous challenges of eating healthy foods while
doing field work w ith some of New York city ’ s more impoverished
populations. When it came time to do her thesis, she thought, why
not write a cookbook of health r ecipes aimed at the millions of
Americans living on food stamps or SNAP stipends of $4 a day .

Leanne Brown: $4 a day is sort of the general rule of thumb for around how much a
person who is qualifying for food stamps would have to eat per day.
We felt like that was more useful sort of explanation, a way of saying
this is a SNAP cookbook without actually saying it in so many words .

Mark Masselli: She learned that the lack of access to nutritious food was also
contributing to obesity and poor health in many o f these families , so
she crafted Good and Cheap . A cookbook aimed at not only teaching
these families how to shop for affordable produce and healthy foods,
but how to get an entire family to cook in a more healthy way.

Leanne Brown: I really wanted to arm people with the ability to walk into a grocery
store and say like, okay, this is my sale. I can totally make somethin g
delicious out of that. I know how to do that and you know, that ’ s not
the easiest thing to be able to do. For a lot of people you go this is the
recipe I have , this is my list of ingredients I better go and carefully
shop for each of those. But that does n ’ t allow you to sort of find the
deals and find the value in order to really get a buy - on on such a small
amount of money. You need to be able to be adaptable.

Mark Masselli: Her thesis was so well received. She launched a Kickstarter campaign
to raise en ough money to make the book available at Soup Kitchens,
women ’ s shelters and community health centers. For every copy she
sells , she gives one free copy to a school, a health center or an
organization that request it .

Leanne Brown: We can ’ t give these books away completely free but the idea is that
this is a cookbook that needs to be put into the hairs of someone who
really can ’ t afford the c ookbook. That ’ s where the idea of doing a buy
one get one like TOMS shoes came from. What sort of like there are
peopl e out there who are really excited about this issue and have
money to spend on it and who can appreciate that if they can sort of
help to subsidize those who can ’ t.

Mark Masselli: Well, a new version of her book comes out in June. She ’ s made her
book avail able as a free pdf download to anyone who wants it and
thousands of people have already done so Good and Cheap , a
c ookbook aimed at the fo od stamp population or anyone else on fixed

Governor Bill Weld

income for that matter, teaching them how to shop for healthy
produce and m aking that healthier choice into delicious meals,
helping to positively influence their diets, obesity and well - being.
Now , that ’ s a brig ht idea.

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Mark Masselli: You ’ ve been listening to Conversations on Health Care. I ’ m Mark
Masselli.

Margaret Flint er: I ’ m Margaret Flinter.

Mark Masselli: Peace and health.

Female : Conversations on Health Care is recorded at WESU at Wesleyan
Universi ty, streaming live at www.chcradio.com , iTunes, or wherever
you l isten to podcasts. If you have comments, please e - mail us at
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Health Center.

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